There are many things that puzzle Stuyvesant Town residents these days. Why do voicemail boxes outnumber employees at the management office? Why are my elderly neighbors continually being mugged if Stuy Town has security? How are six washing machines expected to service a building with over 100 apartments? Today Stuy Town residents have another question: Why can't I take photos in Stuyvesant Town anymore?Stuyvesant Town residents are contacting Lux living about a new "rule" that prevents residents from taking photos on the college dorm. Last week a resident was sitting by the fountain in the Oval which he was about to take a photo of when security showed up and told the resident he needed a permit from the management office to take photos on the property.
Today Lux Living got an email from another resident who was taking pictures of a friend in town for a visit when security butted in, the tenant writes:
"I was out recently on the property with my DSLR in hand, and accompanied by a friend of mine from out of town who was visiting me, when I was accosted by a Peace Officer (whom I'll refer to as "Sergeant Schulz" because I'm still annoyed at him) who first demanded that show proof that I was a resident of Stuy Town. When I was able to do so, he then demanded to know if my friend - whose picture I was taking - had given me permission to take his photograph. When my friend said yes (obviously enough), Sergeant Schulz then launched into a sermon about how people were "very touchy" about pictures being taken of them, stated that there was a rule that prohibited picture-taking, and then told me that I could only take pictures of my friend, but not of anyone else or of the property.
When I started to object, Sergeant Schulz told me that I could either follow his rules (yes, it went from management's rules to "my rules") or I could leave the property, with the rather clear inference that if I did neither, he would confiscate my camera.
Putting aside the ethical and legal issues (including the fact that, as commissioned Peace Officers, Sergeant Schulz and his cronies are state actors and, as such, are subject to the strictures of the Constitution, including that they cannot prohibit me from exercising my First Amendment rights without very good cause), the practical effect is this: If you carry a camera into the Stuy Town (and presumably also PCV), and it is visible, be prepared to be grilled over your use of the camera, your right to be on the property, and be forewarned that the little Nazi confronting you may attempt to seize your camera."
What have we learned? Stuyvesant Town's security is useless at catching criminals who mug residents on the property, even with the aid of an expensive, intrusive security system, but watch out of you want to take photos of your friends in Stuy Town! They have "rules" that prevent that sort of thing.
This can't be true. Just unbelievable....
This is absolutely ridiculous. I would show those guards my resident ID, along with a copy of my law degree, the Constitution, and my middle finger. Then, I'd take a picture of them and send them to Lux Living.
Obviously the pictures posted here and on the Stuy Town Reporter have had an impact. If someone has experienced this problem they should contact the press (both the T&V and the NY Post would be interested) as well as the various local politicians.
My wife and I recently looked at apartments in Stuyvesant Town and we ended up taking an apartment some place else. The person we dealt with in the leasing off was too eager to tell us everything we wanted to hear and something seemed off.
After looking at several apartments we walked around and started talking to a few couples near the park. We asked them what they thought about Stuyvesant Town and if they liked living there and we couldn't believe the stories. Then I Googled Stuyvesant Town and found this site. I undertsand it has a particular take on the Stuyvesant Town and it's supposed to be funny but it touches on a lot of the problems I heard about from the people we spoke with. We are so happy we didn't move there.
When I get emails like these it irritates me that Town & Village doesn't have a website and make more of an effort to get involved with the "community." People can say Lux Living is biased and I agree, it is, but there is a lot of truth to this site that local papers should be covering, especially T&V since they are the ST/PCV newspaper.
It's no great revelation that printed newspapers are going to be obsolete in 10 minutes. Would it kill T&V to install Word Press or Movable Type and have a web presence? Or at the very least, a home page that has their contact information? I wanted to send some information regarding this 'no photos' BS to Sabina but do you think I could find her email address anywhere??? No.
End rant.
First of all, I don't think they can legally confiscate cameras. This is still the USA and although the natives of Sty-Town ARE criminally repressed, this is not a third-world nation.
Second of all, there will be a BIG problem if some pickle smoocher with a plastic badge attempts to take my camera. Let's just say I'll have a new set hanging from my rear view mirror. Apparently, in an attempt to silence the
voice(s) in this ghetto of urban blight from drawing even more unwelcome attention to the two poster boys for how not to manage a cockroach race, Jerry & Robbie are once again trying to strong-arm residents. HELLO! These are New Yorkers, boys. Survivors of a hell of lot more than any harm Trash-Sputum thinks they can inflict. BLAH!!
Let's schedule a mass photo session for Saturday at noon. Everyone come take pictures at the fountain.
I'm waiting for someone to make a comparison between the Management Office and the Iranian government...anyone?
Given their ineffective response to noise complaints and the like, I doubt Stuy Town's security guards will be able to enforce this rule.
I'm game! Fun! Fun!
Hey-yo, another JD in here. Good.
As much as I would love to flip off a cop or 2 sometimes (like the ones just yesterday who were using a yellow cab with Taxi plates, ads on the roof, tlc registration number and all on 14th/1st to make traffic stops and issue tickets), you can't. I did it to a cop once in 2005 for pissing me off after punching my client and I was arrested for 'disorderly conduct' (aka- the charge cops pull when nothing else fits).
Maybe a photograph of my middle finger? You could send it mass email-style to everyone at ST, like Cohen, Tolani, that bimbo Emily, etc., and kill 47 birds with one fell swoop.
Has anyone received notice of any of this? I'm pretty sure if no signs are posted you can't enforce it (same as the no smoking laws), but what the hell does one guy care if you're taking a picture of your friend anyway?
Lux, follow up with our intellectually-challeneged friend Ms. Perrone re: this issue if you can. A lot of people await...
I agree. Let's all meet in the Oval at noon on Saturday, cameras in hand. Let's see if ST Toy Town Cops show up with tear gas and riot gear. Maybe TishSpy [mis]Management will send in the tanks and we will have a Tieneman Square situation - only difference being that these tanks wouldn't stop!
These are not cops. These are Toy Town Cops and I don't think they can arrest anyone for flipping the bird. Besides, there are more of us than there are of them. Do you think they'll bring in back up from the 13th Precinct for a photo rebellion in the Oval?
Re the question "why isn't T & V more responsive/available" when it comes to stories regarding Tishman Speyer's rapacious behavior in Stuy Town -- Tishman Speyer runs big ads in T&S, don't they? Revenue from full-page ads is precious, more precious than ever before. It's certainly possible that the revenue influences the paper's editorial direction, n'est-ce pas?
This cannot possibly be true. They cannot simply confiscate your property. I wish someone who knew the law would come on and tell us how plausible this is. If true, I will refuse to give them the camera and make them arrest me. Can you imagine how irritated the 13th Precinct will be by having their time consumed by this.
Stuy Town advertises on Curbed too but they run stories from Lux Living. Last I checked we don't live in North Korea. We can turn off the state sponsored radio!
A photo-rally at the oval on Saturday sounds awesome! I assume that it'll be at high-noon given that it's going to be a shoot-out (or, at least, a shoot-in, to keep the terminology correct).
I was told not to take pictures of the property, too, and was not in a position to be able to raise a ruckus about it at the time, so I would be all for a photo shoot-out to show them we can't be so easily cowed.
Luxie,
You can reach Sabina at editor@townvillage.net
I think there's a public phone # listed for the T&V office too.
Here's a relevant article from USA Today:
Misinformation About Your Photography Rights Continues to Spread:
"No one can legally take your camera or your memory card without a court order."
http://www.usatoday.com/tech/columnist/andrewkantor/2006-08-11-photography-rights_x.htm
And this:
A Stand for Photographer's Rights (link at bottom):
"The right to take photographs in the United States is being challenged more than ever. People are being stopped, harassed, and even intimidated into handing over their personal property simply because they were taking photographs of subjects that made other people uncomfortable.....There are not very many legal restrictions on what can be photographed when in public view. Most attempts at restricting photography are done by lower-level security and law enforcement officials acting way beyond their authority. Note that neither the Patriot Act nor the Homeland Security Act have any provisions that restrict photography. Similarly, some businesses have a history of abusing the rights of photographers under the guise of protecting their trade secrets. These claims are almost always meritless because entities are required to keep trade secrets from public view if they want to protect them."
http://www.krages.com/phoright.htm
First, thanks for the link - it's good to know where we stand legally. However, there is a big difference between what's theoretically legal and what the practical effect is. I may be legally entitled to stand in the oval and take pictures until my battery dies (or my card overfloweth), but that right does me little good if I'm harrassed by a little nazi acting under color of law and, somehow, my camera "slips" and hits the floor. I may be released without charge the next day, but I'm still out at least $1,500 for the camera (which essentially makes it irreplaceable right now), and it'll cost me three or four times that to file a lawsuit and prosecute it to a judgment. Since the implicit threat is comply or else it'll cost you four times what you'd ever recover in a lawsuit, the practical result is that the threat trumps the right, unless we can "convince" them otherwise in the court of public opinion.
On that note, I would urge everyone who has been confronted by one of the little nazis, or who is concerned about the use of Gestapo-type tactics to prevent people from doing what they are entitled to do, to contact our public officials and let them know that this bothers enough of their constituents that they should get involved.
Not to argue for the sake of arguing, but the "yellow cab" is absolutely no different than police using UNmarked cars to enforce traffic laws. I don't get your logic.
BTW, those yellow cabs are normally used by anti-crime patrols. The CW being that they're so commonplace, that nobody notices a yellow cab, but they'll spot an unmarked Chevy Impala in a nanosecond.
You also mention 14th and 1st, a city block that's been the location of no less than 3 pedestrian traffic fatalities in the past year. Personally, I'd be in favor of cops in garbage trucks, baby buggies, on skateboards or in hot air ballons IF it helps to make our community a safer place and is not simply to harass the locals. Our local streets have become more than a small risk to life and limb in recent times.
And could you please stop using the words Nazi and Gestapo to refer to things. It trivializes the words and offends many people who lost family in the Holocaust.
Thanks for your consideration.
What MarketRateSchmuck said, esp the part about contacting "our public officials and let them know that this bothers enough of their constituents that they should get involved."
Here's Dan Garodnick's office number: (212) 818-0580
I'd love to pull a Chris Hansen and bait the fascists. That is, shoot photos all over Stuy Town until one of ST's faux cops orders the photographing stopped, and when I refuse, demands the camera, while a cohort secretly videotapes the harassment and eventual illegal confiscation.
There are many fun things one could do with such a revealing video!
I concur with Anon's request. References to Nazis and Gestapo should not be made and are offensive.
I just called security to ask about this.
The person I spoke with said you can't take pictures of "the property." It's a "no-no."
I asked "what if you're just walking around casually taking pictures?"
He said it's okay if you're "taking pictures of your friends," "parents filming their kids," but they don't want people taking pictures of the property and then then they end up "on the internet."
Sounds to me like they don't want people taking pictures of ugly things like paint carelessly splattered on buildings' stoops, or dog excrement or bad/destructive outdoor irrigation, etc. In other words, PRECISELY THE STUFF THAT ENDS UP ON THIS SITE.
I'm not a lawyer but it sounds like not an open-and-shut legal question, because the complex is, I guess, considered private property.
Regardless, it's very wrong of them to do. Considering all the restrictions and monitoring they do to us, it's really unethical of them to do this.
I urge everyone to photograph the property as much as possible.
Technically speaking, these little nazis are so-called "Public Safety Officers" with the NYPD. Don't rush to NYC.gov, though, because you'll find precious few references to this term. As near as I can figure out, they are essentially Auxilliary Police Officers (see http://www.nyc.gov/html/nypd/html/careers/auxiliary_police.shtml) although they obviously aren't "volunteers" since they're paid by Tishman/Speyer.
That, of course, brings up a marvelous conflict of interest that is remarkably well illustrated by this incident - a police officer who has been properly trained should be familiar with the rules and laws described in the link from girl, and would intervene on the side of any photographer who was harrassed by a private security guard, say one who was hired by Tishman/Speyer to guard one of their properties. However, in this case, the so-called "police officer" is intervening on the side of the harrasser, and is doing so in contravention of our legal rights. In other words, the fact that these little nazis get a paycheck from Tishman/Speyer means that they are suborning their public duties as Auxilliary Police Officers to their private financial interests.
In the broader picture, that is something that should also be addressed by the relevant members of the City Council - perhaps Mr. Garodnick would be good enough to get the legislative ball rolling on this one, too?
I just went through the links again, and thanks! I'm printing off several copies of Krage's one-pager entitled "The Photographer's Right" and will be handing them out to any T/S goon who tries to use his uniform and his badge to bully me around.
Simkie, I LIKE you're thinking! Satan's Own will be making a personal appearance at the Oval this Saturday, camera in hand, to join in the clickfest. This is much different than sticking cameras in the faces of so-called stars. As ugly as Sty-Town has become, the public has access to walk through whether they live there or not. If I want to take my picture with the Christmas choir boys in the fountain, (yes; I used the word 'Christmas'!)there isn't a power on earth that will tell me otherwise or take my camera. Never mind my middle digit, I think I'll take a picture of my anus and see if anyone can tell the difference between that and a picture of Jerry. Hint ~ my pic will have less wrinkles! See you at the Oval on Saturday, folks!!
No. I won't, and it doesn't.
I haven't pulled my references, yet, but because of the degree of public access, the absence of any means of restricting that access, and the "public" nature of the grounds, the walkways and playgrounds of Stuy Town are almost certainly "public places" in which the putative owner has only a very limited ability to restrict anyone's photography.
Well it offends myself and others and shows that your self named identity here is truly, truly appropriate.
That said, I don't have to live with you, you do.
Why don't you just drop it, (s)he has.
The hubris of these mall cop wannabes is amazing. Walking through the oval this past Friday evening June 19th at 11pm one of these security guards in his patrol hot rod almost hit me. Getting out of the blue and white SUV the first words out of his mouth were "There are cameras here - you can see I was not close to you". Pressing my point, I was met with first a threat to be issued a summons then the statement "You would not be talking to me like that if I did not have this uniform on." Not entirely sure what the implication of this statement was, I don't feel out of line in thinking that this "bald headed man of power" was saying that if he was in civilian clothes he would assault me.
I'm a Russian Jew who also lost family members in the camps, but don't find the term offensive in the context of how it's being used. You also attacked me weeks ago for using the term, and it was out-of-line. I respect that you don't like the term, understand why, and you're free to share your feelings, but not to infantilize and try to control/censor others by telling them which words they should and should not use. And then when you fail at controlling others, you go on an ad hominem attack, as you just did above.
That's equally as offensive to many, and for good reason.
Look, as you're such a hypersensitive sort, and as I'd rather you stopped trying to derail the conversation, I'll yield my rhetorical rights to your hypersensitivities, ok?
According to the USA Today article, at the most they could charge the person with trespassing on private property, but still wouldn't have the legal right to confiscate the photos or camera:
"You can shoot on private property if it's open to the public. That includes malls, retails stores, Starbucks, banks, and office-building lobbies. If you're asked to stop and refuse, you run the risk of being charged with trespassing, but your pictures are yours. No one can legally take your camera or your memory card without a court order."
The toy soldier makes his point by saying people are "touchy" about having their picture taken? Who are these people going around ST and taking photos of the residents? I've never seen them. And of all the photos I have been emailed since I started the site last year, I can count on one hand the number of photos that were of residents. And I didn't publish them.
I was wondering about that. In particular, given that there is complete public access to the property, and in particular given that, as a tenant, I have paid for the right to have unmolested access to my unit and the common grounds, I don't think they could even force me off the property using the threat of trespass. Of course, most of what they want to hide can just as easily be viewed from public streets and rights-of-way, so they're clearly just trying to get their way by dint of threat and bluster.
It is my understanding that the guards are not allowed to take your property without a court order and if they do that is cause for you to
press charges. By the way if taking pictures is not allowed why are they allowed to have cameras all over the property taking our pictures without our permission.
The "internet" obviously means me. What they fail to realize is that I take 1% of the photos that end up on Lux Living and the rest are all contributions.
Here's a novel idea. Don't let the property look like a dump and perhaps residents won't be so irritated that they go OUT OF THEIR WAY to take photos because they loathe Tishman Speyer than much.
Wooosh! Right over their heads!
Ostensibly, because they own the place; of course, as tenants, not visitors, we have more rights than a stranger who wandered onto the property would have,
That is God's own truth.
That is God's own truth.
I hate the fake police!!! My son plays hockey on Playground 7 behind 449 E14th and on several occasions they have had their games broken up by security before sun down because the park was being closed.
Last night my son called security around 9 when we noticed that WELL AFTER sundown there were kids playing baseball, screaming at the top of their lungs, and racing around the perimeter of the park on those accident-waiting-to-happen scooters. This group of parents/kids are frequently out there and the parents do a rotten job of controlling their kids. They basically let the little things do whatever they want, run through the plants, rip shit up, scream as if they were on their own private island.
Anyway he called security and they cut him off and said "yeah, playground 7, kids, we know! We're trying to find someone to send over." They did nothing about it probably because Lux was writing about it on Twitter and figured they would stick it to all of us and make us listen to those little monsters all night long. Which they did.
The point being is that there is no rhyme or reason to what "rules" the Sponge Bob Fan Club enforces. I dug my camera out of my closet so I can start shooting video of this shit and put it on you tube. Try and stop me!
There was a time, not too long ago, before this loathesome vermin named Tishman Speyer came on the scene,when the landlord would kvell with pride because people were taking photographs of the landscaping and grounds. Of course then they had something to be proud of rather than ashamed of. Security used to be a department of well trained professionals who were employed to protect, not harrass, the tenants as well as make sure no one was damaging the property. They weren't a bunch of uncouth goons in the employ of a Rachman landlord.
Go Alice!! I'm going to dig out my old camcorder too. I'll kick their balls off if they bother me. Yes. Really.
Fugly Nick better watch out when he's photographing the 'glorious bloom' the Oval is rumored to be. The SBFC might beat him down. If only.
Thank you.
Perhaps it's a generational issue, but considering that Stuyvesant Town was built specifically for those returning from the battle of WWII, I find it particularly inappropriate.
Perhaps you don't understand it that way, but that's the way I feel about it.
I view your reply as the "some of my best friends are black" defense.
I shouldn't have to explain this to anyone. It's not a matter of control or censorship, it's a matter of common human decency. And if I'm not mistaken, I spoke to Luxie OFF LIST about your remarks. You want to make a public spectacle ?, feel free.
And just for the record, it doesn't give me any cheap thrills engaging in these discussions. If I could message anyone here privately, I'd much prefer to have the discussion that way, instead of calling out someone in a public forum, but .... cest la vie
That conversation was closed a long time ago. For the sake of expediency, you won; get over it.
"Common human decency" is not something girl is into.
No, you publicly attacked me and a couple of others on this board for the use of the term "grammar nazi." And just like now, you refuse to let it go, launching ad hominem attacks on us. And your insensitive, cynical response after I shared the fact that my own relatives were killed in nazi concentration camps shows a real "lack of common human decency" that you constantly complain about in others.
Just let it go already, dude.
Aw, sweet! Beulah found an ally in another control freak!
"Common human decency" is not something girl is into.
Oh shit!
I thought this thread was about our rights when it comes to taking photos in ST?
Hell, if we are going to rehash old BS, lest not forget the spirited conversations about the "thuggish" security officers, or the "holiday" tree, and how can we forget the conversation about how grilled chicken vs fried chicken somehow qualified someone a racist.
It's no wonder people coming from other sites think we're nuts. Sometimes, we are. Knock this shit off already.
I called Garodnick's office. They have been in touch with ST's corporate management and are awaiting their official answer on the specifics of, and reasoning behind, the policy.
I also told them that as a constituent, I strongly object to this inappropriate policy of my landlord.
Oh they are so lucky they didn't pick on me. But then, maybe, so am I because security here is so totally in bed with the 13th Pct.
Hm. Maybe the video referenced in T&V of a now unemployed security guard who allegedly assaulted a couple of dog walkers started this?
MRS, don't be such a hardass! Anonymous, no matter how many times those words are used, there is nothing that could ever trivialize the Holocaust. But I won't use them in deference to you.
We can make a giant ring-around-the-Oval and take pictures of one another. Now, where did I put those old tie-dyed T-shirts.....
I think they are with your Laugh In t shirt ;)
You don't get the logic because you're not a JD. Or at least a good one.
Unmarked is unmarked, as no different with plates, colors, etc. But to soup up a taxi cab with lights in the grill and a siren, complete with TAXI PLATES, registration, ads, and the like, is actually illegal under NYS law as grounds for harassment. The law permits the People to have a fair warning of who and what the cops are up to since women in the 70's were killed by 'police' in unmarked cars with stolen and/or improvised lights and sirens.
Garbage truck and stollers huh? They ACLU would have a field day with your 'logic.'
Luxie, does it count if the resident(s) are in a drunken stupor, passed out in puddles of their own sick and/or urine and/or fecal matter? What about pigeons and their families who are residents or does it only apply to rent-stabilized resident pigeons who are passed out as the above-described? WTF?!
I'm afraid I don't get your logic because undercover cops dressed as bums, rabbis, etc., ride the subways to catch perps in the act.
I suspect that Satan's Own was at Woodstock and hasn't quite come down from the "high" yet! ;-)
Does anyone remember the calendars MetLife put out from 2005-2007 with fabulous pictures of Stuy Town and PCV when it really was beautiful? "It's the Setting That Sets Us Apart" meant something. People were encouraged and inspired to submit photos of "the property." It's hard to believe this is the same place and that photos now are for a very different reason.
Youreeka! It's with my genuine 'sock-it-to-me' sweatshirt! Thanks, Luxie!
OMG! I was on the phone with someone and could hear the children of the corn on Playground 7 through the damn phone. Screaming hellions from the 8th circle of the Inferno. I thought banshees were getting their throats torn out and stepped on!
Dang. I'll give you 50 bucks for that sweatshirt. Dashing off to eBay...
Beulah, lover, friend, patron of the Constitution. Yes, this is to ward off petty crimes, drugs, prostitutes, roudy dorm students, etc., which all fall under 'cpl' (criminal law), not 'vtl' (traffic law). There are limits even as to how 'incognito' a cop car can appear, or else any boy in blue would be allowed to throw a siren and lights on his Karmann Ghia and start pulling over any Tom, Dick, or Harry who gave 'em a bad look...then he'd go and rape a lady.
You make it sound like it's a bad thing!
OMG you are off the hook! lol
Yes! I remember those. I also remember Stuytown's "50th Birthday" in 1997 when they sent out calendars and fridge magnets with photographs of the Oval. That's when the Oval was green and beautiful and filled with lovely shade trees. It's hard to believe that what's left of what used to be the Oval could ever have been that beautiful. I have tons of photographs taken in the 80s and 90s of the way ST looked back then. I have to look at them to remind myself that that is what it really looked like. Tishman Speyer want to tear down the development and, as they can't destroy the buildings yet, they've started with the grounds.
Pish! I could get more than $50 clams for that sweatshirt, my friend! However, I'd gladly fork over the $50 to see a cop in a baby buggy!
No! NO! It was a GOOD thing! I have always been unconsolable over the fact that I missed it!
Tons of "Sock it to Me" on eBay in tee shirts. I am soooooo close to getting one and going out for a photo shoot.
Truth? So did I; for real. Let's just say I was too young to drive and too old for diapers! Now, the 70's were another story altogether, Miss Beulah. 'Purple Haze' indeed.
Speaking of Sunshine, Woodstock is cranking up in the oval. Get your tie dyes and peace medallions out, boys and girls! See you in the mud?
Maybe some of those should find their way to our favorite blogmaster.... A Before and after montage. Utopia vs Dismal Abyss.
Purple Haze, Satan's Own? Now you're talking my kind of farmers market!
Dude; no way! Bet if you get one you won't be able to still smell the pot and spilled Boone's Farm Apple Wine on it, so there! Let the rains begin and crank up Santana's 'Soul Sacrifice'! See you in the mud. The new amenity, Oval Aging Hippie Museum!
I'll see if I can find some that don't feature my family circus. That's a good idea, Satan's Own. Before and after the pirate invasion.
Invasion of the Ass Bandits and Anal Pirates! Oh, snap!!
Actually, I'm going to pass. I'm gritting my teeth in rythm with the bass. Antedote: I got me a groovy dusty fine vintage bottle of Strawberry Hill here and I'm off to crack it.
I saw a whole bunch of emergency vehicles and toy cop vehicles hurtling toward the Oval earlier. (The sirens actually sounded more musical than the crap noise coming from "musicians"). I wonder if they found some space-loathing photographer who lives in the Oval snapping shots of the mud!
So, I'm back from wandering around with my camera prominently displayed, and someone must have sent an emergency memo around, 'cause nary a soul said "boo" about it.
At any rate, I wouldn't expect that blessing to last too long - short attention spans and whatnot - so I'm hoping we're still on for a Shoot-Out on Saturday? Yea or nea, I'll be there.
I don't get it--how can you still be "anonymous"? I thought that signing in was required now.
Yes for me on Saturday. WTG Simkie. Great idea! I love it!
E-line- not everyone has the mental capacity to think of an original screen name, so they register their username as 'anonymous'.
(and some of my best friends are black)
I wonder if this "No Photographing" edict came down the the Ayatollah Speyer or from his paid brown-nose, Bud Perrone? I think they're skating on dangerously thin ice legally and they are proving what fools they are because they are bringing upon themselves even more contempt and ridicule. Maybe that asscrack in Iran is Robbie's role model. (Ahmadinnerjacket as Whoopie Goldberg calls him - I love it!)
I will be there on Saturday.
I suggest that if The Securitate gets anywhere near, we all start filming each other, in a row:
Person A shoots the property; Person B starts shooting A if Securitate starts bothering Person A; C shoots B; D shoots C, etc.
It's a defense against B being harassed for shooting A, and so on.
I know, I'm anticipating a glorious, historic event, and probably nothing will even happen! But it is still worth participating in this as a protest.
like ussual you guys are clueless. one of the reason security is doing this is because a lot of us parents have ask them too. i am with my kids in the playgrounds quite a bit and there are times when men try to take pictures of inside the playgrounds from outside. if i would ever see that and there is no security around i would personally rip the camera out of their hands and smash it on the ground. we already have a pediphile living on the property(that the management has tried to remove for years but because of the great lawyers and our great judicial system they can't).
My wife and I will show up at the fountain at noon on Saturday as well. The more of us who show up the better. Even if you don't have a camera. Remember, management monitors this web site and if only 1 or 2 people show up they will consider it some sort of symboLic victory. In the words of Britain's Special Air Service (Their commando units): WHO DARES WINS.
You are so full of shit it's not even funny. Did you ever think those men might be the parents of the kids playing? My parents took photos of me playing baseball for years but that hardly makes them pedophiles.
I thought this guy was gone. He's so stupid. Hey, Skibum, I hope you pick on the wrong person, rip the camera out of their hands and that they beat the shit out of you, you idiot. I can't believe you have kids. OMG. Don't help them with their homework you illiterate, misguided piece of garbage! Someone sleeps with this moron. You're right, LL. He's so full of shit.
If "the bum" doesn't want a photographer to take photos near his children, he should tell him/her so or take the children out of camera range. Attempts by private security forces to stop people from using cameras are futile and illegal. Contact The International Center for Photography for additional information about illegal equipment/image seizure.
In the interest of increasing the general level of civility and respect for others, this professional photographer offers a helpful tip: when photographing in any public space where a person not know to you may be recognizable in your composition, always ask the person's permission (or the permission of a child's guardian) before taking the photo. This is a good common sense practice that amateur photographers can easily adopt.
when a man without visible children takes pictures in or around a playground it is not for a good reason. i don't and neither do most of the other parents i have taked too around the playgrounds what people taking pictures in the playgrounds.
What about men with invisible children?
you are so smart and funny
And you are so stupid, illiterate, moronic and just a bad joke. I hope there's a photographer there when someone knocks you on your stupid ass.
I frequent the main PCV playground, the dinosaur playground, and the townhall playground in the center of Stuy Town with my 4 y.o. child, and I have NEVER seen hide nor hair of anyone trying to take pictures of the insides of a playground from the outside of the playground. I've been at these playgrounds at various times and days during the week and on the weekend, and have never seen anything like what you describe. Perhaps I'm missing the one playground where this does occur.
I also generally tend to bring my DSLR and my big kit bag with me when we go to a playground (either to take pics of my kid, or to experiment with pics of leaves, flowers, trees, shrubs, the playground equipment (sans other people's children) and the like) and I have never had a single problem with any of the other parents, whether or not it's apparent that I am with my kid. In fact, the only interactions I've had with other parents have involved other camera nuts who are interested in the camera I use (Pentax K10D); I've only had two parents ask me to take pics of their kids and send them the pics, which I have gladly done.
If you have a problem with me or anyone else taking pictures on a playground, and you cannot in good faith determine if we're there with a child, why not come over and have a little chat with us? I am quite the talker when someone gets me going on my favorite hobby.
Furthermore, as the photographers' rights materials make clear, unless you can demonstrate something like stalking, harrassment, or the like, or that the photographer is clearly a commercial photographer taking photos for commercial use, you have no right to prevent someone else who is lawfully on the playground from taking pictures of anything and anyone else who happens to be on the playground, and that includes your children.
Now, the fact of the matter is, since I have a 4 y.o. kid, I am as sensitive as you to anyone taking an unhealthy interest in my kid, and accordingly I do not go out of my way to take pictures of other peoples' children - generally they only show up in my pictures if the child is playing with my kid. If I see someone who seems to be paying too much attention to my kid, I go over and talk to them, in a friendly manner, to see if I can suss them out. I would invite you to do the same.
I don't doubt that most parents - both those with and those without cameras - feel this way, and I am quite certain that almost every parent who shows up with a camera will be quite happy to discuss with you what they're doing, which child(ren) is(are) theirs, and whether or not your child shows up in any of their pictures (be careful, if they're like me, they may have several hundred pictures on their memory card, and you may be in for a very long afternoon of looking at pictures of my kid).
Beyond that, if you see someone who seems to be lurking around, sneaking around, or focusing on a child who doesn't appear to have any connection with them, please use your parental standing to intervene and find out what's going on. If you approach someone, you will very quickly find out if they constitute a physical threat, at which point you are fully justified in calling security to remove the person - but then for constituting a physical threat, not for merely taking pictures of your kid.
Lay off skibummonel, despite his/her rudeness.
When I read the quote that people get "touchy," I immediately thought of maybe women sunbathing on the oval (okay, I think of them often) and the many families with kids.
Those people have a right to be "touchy" about people taking pictures.
HOWEVER, they have to be ready to take some responsibility for themselves and either confront the suspicious photographer, or, if they're understandably not comfortable doing that, call police/security. And police/security should then handle photographers ON An INCIDENT-BY-INCIDENT BASIS, not implement some outrageous rule that affects everyone.
ALSO, skibummonel, AS I REPORTED ABOVE, the Securitate itself acknowledged that one reason (if not the entire reason) for the rule is that ST doesn't want pictures of the property ending up "ON THE INTERNET."
I can understand parents being opposed to people taking photographs of their children, but I don't believe that the Stuy Spies take any photographs of children; rather, they are taking photos of the crappy conditions created by TS. I have never seen any children in the photographs on this site. This latest illegal and arbitrary law-making by TS is just to intimidate people into not posting photographs of the evidence of their incompetence on the internet. They're too stupid to realize that it will only backfire on them.
Re: Skibum
Never. No one's shutting him up and I'm not being censored. He's a fool and no one's been appointed hall monitor here.
Lois, just my saying "lay off" doesn't give me any hall monitor powers. I was just saying it.
You are just making shit up at this point. Funny how you fail to mention how you called security on this so called pedophile and tell us of the outcome. Why? because you are full of shit.
As usual, skibummonel misses the point. This ban is not about photos of his or her kids. Management does not care if photos are taken of people here. Security has said so. Security been quite specific about what will no longer be tolerated. Management does not want pictures taken of the property.
The ban has nothing to do with sunbathing on the Oval or kids on playgrounds. Security has stated it is specifically a ban on photographing the property.
which means we will take more and more photographs of the property.
you guys are children
Why? Exercising one's rights to quiet enjoyment and possession of the property we pay good rent for? Objecting to the landlord's improper interference with those rights?
"Oh I hate it when she pummels us with clever repartee." --Julia Sugarbaker
And you are an ignoramus.
I am a child. And I'm off to the playground to swing on the swings and take some photos.
"Oh I hate it when she pummels us with clever repartee"
....which "runs the gamut of emotions from A to B."
- Dorothy Parker
Just when I'd figured out how to use my cell phone camera, I found they had fixed the four machines that had had "out of order" signs on for the past 8 or 9 weeks. Next time. Knowing Mac Gray's record, there will be a next time, though I hope not.
This is pathetic.... I pay too much for what this piece of shit place is, and they have a rule like this. The moron at the leasing office sure didn't mention anything like this, what a bitch!